Hi Buchan,

I built the OpenLDAP server myself, and it's dynamically linked to the shared library libdb-4.3.so provided by db4-4.3.29-9.fc6. My platform team is actually trying to get our Linux vendor to upgrade the library and they are asking for the details. I guess if that fails I can try a static build with the upgraded library, but we are in a space constrained environment and try as much as possible to use dynamic libraries.

Cheers,

Craig

-----Original Message----- From: Buchan Milne [mailto:bgmilne@staff.telkomsa.net] Sent: Tuesday, July 29, 2008 4:50 AM To: openldap-software@openldap.org Cc: Worgan, Craig (BVW:9T16) Subject: Re: BDB 4.3 instability

On Tuesday 29 July 2008 01:21:57 Craig Worgan wrote:

Hi,

Does anyone know the specifics of the instability of BDB 4.3 (see http://www.openldap.org/faq/data/cache/44.html)? I run OpenLDAP on a RedHat platform that ships with BDB 4.3

But, does the OpenLDAP package on that "platform" (would you not prefer to provide a version instead?) actually link to the system BDB 4.3 ?

$ rpm -q openldap-servers openldap-servers-2.2.13-4

$ rpm -qR openldap-servers|grep db-4 libslapd_db-4.2.so

$ rpm -q --whatprovides libslapd_db-4.2.so openldap-servers-2.2.13-4

So, it's linked to an internal copy of 4.2. BDB version may not be your biggest problem.

BTW: http://staff.telkomsa.net/packages/rhel4/openldap/

Regards, Buchan

Buchan,

My question is not "platform" specific. In the OpenLDAP Software FAQ there is a statement that BDB 4.3 is unstable. I am simply asking for the details behind that statememt. In the future I will provide no platform related details when asking a question where they are not pertinent.

Craig

-----Original Message----- From: Buchan Milne [mailto:bgmilne@staff.telkomsa.net] Sent: Tuesday, July 29, 2008 8:39 AM To: Worgan, Craig (BVW:9T16) Cc: openldap-software@openldap.org Subject: Re: BDB 4.3 instability

I'm going to assume that your "vendor" is Red Hat, and that you are running RHEL5 (based on the package version you supplied). It would really help to provide this kind of information up-front when you are asking specifically about "platform" issues.

1)Red Hat is not going to upgrade/downgrade db4 to 4.2 or 4.4 or 4.5 on RHEL5.

2)There is no reason why you should need to upgrade the system db4 package to build OpenLDAP, as evidenced by:

http://staff.telkomsa.net/packages/rhel5/openldap/x86_64/

(the 2.3 packages ship an internal db-4.2.52.6 or so, and the 2.4 packages ship an internal 4.6)

Regards, Buchan

On Tuesday 29 July 2008 14:11:33 Craig Worgan wrote:

Hi Buchan,

I built the OpenLDAP server myself, and it's dynamically linked to the

shared library libdb-4.3.so provided by db4-4.3.29-9.fc6. My platform

team is actually trying to get our Linux vendor to upgrade the library

and they are asking for the details. I guess if that fails I can try a static build with the upgraded library, but we are in a space constrained environment and try as much as possible to use dynamic libraries.

Cheers,

Craig

-----Original Message----- From: Buchan Milne [mailto:bgmilne@staff.telkomsa.net] Sent: Tuesday, July 29, 2008 4:50 AM To: openldap-software@openldap.org Cc: Worgan, Craig (BVW:9T16) Subject: Re: BDB 4.3 instability

On Tuesday 29 July 2008 01:21:57 Craig Worgan wrote:

...

Hi,

Does anyone know the specifics of the instability of BDB 4.3 (see http://www.openldap.org/faq/data/cache/44.html)? I run OpenLDAP on a RedHat platform that ships with BDB 4.3

But, does the OpenLDAP package on that "platform" (would you not prefer to provide a version instead?) actually link to the system BDB

4.3 ?

$ rpm -q openldap-servers openldap-servers-2.2.13-4

$ rpm -qR openldap-servers|grep db-4 libslapd_db-4.2.so

$ rpm -q --whatprovides libslapd_db-4.2.so openldap-servers-2.2.13-4

So, it's linked to an internal copy of 4.2. BDB version may not be your biggest problem.

BTW: http://staff.telkomsa.net/packages/rhel4/openldap/

Regards, Buchan

Howard,

I am running OpenLDAP on a paired down version of RHEL5.1. We build OpenLDAP and roll our own RPM due to our requirement for the PPOLICY module and our desire to be able to pick up different OpenLDAP versions for new features and bug fixes. Yesterday I tried building 2.4 due to your recommendation from another post, and got the following build error:

checking for Berkeley DB major version... 4 checking for Berkeley DB minor version... 3 checking for Berkeley DB link (-ldb-4.3)... yes checking for Berkeley DB version match... yes checking for Berkeley DB thread support... yes checking Berkeley DB version for BDB/HDB backends... no configure: error: BDB/HDB: BerkeleyDB version incompatible

During my investigation I discovered the FAQ about BBD 4.3 being unstable. I took this information to my platform/base team and we discussed upgrading the library for all of our apps, as it's a commonly used shared library. They want to bring this info to RedHat and they asked me to dig into the statement that BDB 4.3 is unstable.

I do appreciate the help and didn't intend it to come across otherwise.

Thanks

Craig

-----Original Message----- From: openldap-software-bounces+worganc=nortel.com@openldap.org [mailto:openldap-software-bounces+worganc=nortel.com@openldap.org] On Behalf Of Howard Chu Sent: Tuesday, July 29, 2008 10:50 AM To: Worgan, Craig (BVW:9T16) Cc: Buchan Milne; openldap-software@openldap.org Subject: Re: BDB 4.3 instability

Craig Worgan wrote:

Buchan,

My question is not "platform" specific. In the OpenLDAP Software FAQ there is a statement that BDB 4.3 is unstable. I am simply asking for

the details behind that statememt.

And Buchan was simply asking for the details behind your statement.

In the future I will provide no platform related details when asking a question where they are not pertinent.

Since you're the one asking for help, it's a fair guess that you're in less of a position to judge what is or isn't pertinent than the people on this list trying to help you.

"BDB 4.3 is unstable." That's all you need to know, the details aren't pertinent...

Craig

-----Original Message----- From: Buchan Milne [mailto:bgmilne@staff.telkomsa.net] Sent: Tuesday, July 29, 2008 8:39 AM To: Worgan, Craig (BVW:9T16) Cc: openldap-software@openldap.org Subject: Re: BDB 4.3 instability

I'm going to assume that your "vendor" is Red Hat, and that you are running RHEL5 (based on the package version you supplied). It would really help to provide this kind of information up-front when you are asking specifically about "platform" issues.

1)Red Hat is not going to upgrade/downgrade db4 to 4.2 or 4.4 or 4.5 on RHEL5.

2)There is no reason why you should need to upgrade the system db4 package to build OpenLDAP, as evidenced by:

http://staff.telkomsa.net/packages/rhel5/openldap/x86_64/

(the 2.3 packages ship an internal db-4.2.52.6 or so, and the 2.4 packages ship an internal 4.6)

Regards, Buchan

On Tuesday 29 July 2008 14:11:33 Craig Worgan wrote:

...

Hi Buchan,

I built the OpenLDAP server myself, and it's dynamically linked to the

...

shared library libdb-4.3.so provided by db4-4.3.29-9.fc6. My platform

...

team is actually trying to get our Linux vendor to upgrade the library

...

and they are asking for the details. I guess if that fails I can try

...

a static build with the upgraded library, but we are in a space constrained environment and try as much as possible to use dynamic libraries.

Cheers,

Craig

-----Original Message----- From: Buchan Milne [mailto:bgmilne@staff.telkomsa.net] Sent: Tuesday, July 29, 2008 4:50 AM To: openldap-software@openldap.org Cc: Worgan, Craig (BVW:9T16) Subject: Re: BDB 4.3 instability

On Tuesday 29 July 2008 01:21:57 Craig Worgan wrote:

...

Hi,

Does anyone know the specifics of the instability of BDB 4.3 (see http://www.openldap.org/faq/data/cache/44.html)? I run OpenLDAP on a RedHat platform that ships with BDB 4.3

But, does the OpenLDAP package on that "platform" (would you not prefer to provide a version instead?) actually link to the system BDB

4.3 ?

...

$ rpm -q openldap-servers openldap-servers-2.2.13-4

$ rpm -qR openldap-servers|grep db-4 libslapd_db-4.2.so

$ rpm -q --whatprovides libslapd_db-4.2.so openldap-servers-2.2.13-4

So, it's linked to an internal copy of 4.2. BDB version may not be your biggest problem.

BTW: http://staff.telkomsa.net/packages/rhel4/openldap/

Regards, Buchan

Thanks Buchan. I'm going to look into the approaches you recommend.

Cheers,

Craig

-----Original Message----- From: Buchan Milne [mailto:bgmilne@staff.telkomsa.net] Sent: Tuesday, July 29, 2008 12:27 PM To: Worgan, Craig (BVW:9T16) Cc: openldap-software@openldap.org Subject: Re: BDB 4.3 instability

On Tuesday 29 July 2008 17:55:45 Craig Worgan wrote:

Howard,

I am running OpenLDAP on a paired down version of RHEL5.1. We build OpenLDAP and roll our own RPM due to our requirement for the PPOLICY module and our desire to be able to pick up different OpenLDAP versions for new features and bug fixes.

This is a valid argument to run a version of OpenLDAP other than Red Hat supplies, however it is not necessarily an argument for building your own from source manually. You could consider using the binaries I provide:

http://staff.telkomsa.net/packages/rhel5/openldap/

Or, you could rebuild the SRPM I provide: http://staff.telkomsa.net/packages/SRPMS/openldap/openldap2.3-2.3.42-1.r hel4es.src.rpm

(I'm not sure what happened to the 2.3.43 package, I'll track it down tomorrow, but the same content exists as openldap2.3-2.3.43-1mdv2009.0.src.rpm on any Mandriva mirror).

Yesterday I tried building 2.4 due to your recommendation from another post, and got the following build error:

checking for Berkeley DB major version... 4 checking for Berkeley DB minor version... 3 checking for Berkeley DB link (-ldb-4.3)... yes checking for Berkeley DB version match... yes checking for Berkeley DB

thread support... yes checking Berkeley DB version for BDB/HDB backends... no configure: error: BDB/HDB: BerkeleyDB version incompatible

During my investigation I discovered the FAQ about BBD 4.3 being unstable. I took this information to my platform/base team and we discussed upgrading the library for all of our apps, as it's a commonly used shared library.

It is not necessary to use the same version of the library across all the applications that require a version of the library. You will notice that Red Hat doesn't do so, nor do I.

If you want the details, look at the spec file:

http://svn.mandriva.com/cgi- bin/viewvc.cgi/packages/cooker/openldap2.3/current/SPECS/openldap2.3.spe c?view=log

(beware line-breaks, I need to file a bug on kmail in kde 4.1.0 ...)

They want to bring this info to RedHat and they asked me to dig into the statement that BDB 4.3 is unstable.

In my experience in dealing with Red Hat (considering that OpenLDAP is not AFAIK on the list of supported services on RHEL, compared to say squid or samba), you're wasting your time.

I do appreciate the help and didn't intend it to come across

otherwise.

But, I have attempted to point you to real solutions to your problem that are available immediately, without logging a ticket with Red Hat, explaining to 3 clueless support agents the whole issue and why they can't just fob it off, until you have the chance to speak to someone, who will tell you that what you are trying to do is unsupported anyway, without them having been able to ask anyone in engineering (who are the only people who could provide you with the real answer, which is most likely going to be "why do you want a supported database library for an unsupported package, which you have built yourself anyway" or similar.

I started building my own packages of OpenLDAP for RHEL 2.1 AS, and I don't have any plans to stop for RHEL5, maybe RHEL 6 will eventually allow me to stop. Considering that we have all the support we need from Red Hat, and why I would do this ...

Regards, Buchan

As a point of reference, I tried building our DB (500k+ entries) on Centos 5.1 and it flopped miserably because of the db 4.3.

Fedora 9 with db 4.4 seems to be chugging along nicely so far. :)

Fedora 9 ships with db 4.4.x and openldap 2.4x and that is probably the src.rpm I would use. It statically links db into it so you won't run into any issues with the versions db being mismatched.

You might also be able to swank the db tree from the Fedora 9 source tree and drop that in the RH/Centos 5.1 src.rpm and just eliminate the issue.

However backup your database before trying this. :)

On Tue, 29 Jul 2008, Howard Chu wrote:

Craig Worgan wrote:

...

Howard,

I am running OpenLDAP on a paired down version of RHEL5.1. We build OpenLDAP and roll our own RPM due to our requirement for the PPOLICY module and our desire to be able to pick up different OpenLDAP versions for new features and bug fixes. Yesterday I tried building 2.4 due to your recommendation from another post, and got the following build error:

checking for Berkeley DB major version... 4 checking for Berkeley DB minor version... 3 checking for Berkeley DB link (-ldb-4.3)... yes checking for Berkeley DB version match... yes checking for Berkeley DB thread support... yes checking Berkeley DB version for BDB/HDB backends... no configure: error: BDB/HDB: BerkeleyDB version incompatible

During my investigation I discovered the FAQ about BBD 4.3 being unstable. I took this information to my platform/base team and we discussed upgrading the library for all of our apps, as it's a commonly used shared library. They want to bring this info to RedHat and they asked me to dig into the statement that BDB 4.3 is unstable.

We tested BDB 4.3 heavily when it first appeared in 2005. In those tests we found that it tended to SEGV under heavy concurrent load. Building against BDB 4.2 showed none of these problems. You can probably check the openldap-devel archives from that timeframe for more details.

I also forwarded this information to the RedHat/FedoraDS team when I saw them integrating BDB 4.3 support in November 2006, but they ignored the info.

As usual, the RedHat folks are not only clueless, but aggressively so.

...

I do appreciate the help and didn't intend it to come across otherwise.

Buchan knows what he's doing... If you don't want to follow his approach you might want to consider using commercially supported RPMs from people who are actually competent in supporting OpenLDAP (e.g., from Symas) to save yourself all of this hassle.

-------------------------------------- Sean O'Malley, Information Technologist Michigan State University -------------------------------------

Thanks Howard,

I passed your info on and we'll see what comes of it. I'm looking at Buchan's spec file figure out how to link BDB 4.6 and otherwise improve my build.

Cheers,

Craig

-----Original Message----- From: openldap-software-bounces+worganc=nortel.com@openldap.org [mailto:openldap-software-bounces+worganc=nortel.com@openldap.org] On Behalf Of Howard Chu Sent: Tuesday, July 29, 2008 1:13 PM To: Worgan, Craig (BVW:9T16) Cc: Buchan Milne; openldap-software@openldap.org Subject: Re: BDB 4.3 instability

Craig Worgan wrote:

Howard,

I am running OpenLDAP on a paired down version of RHEL5.1. We build OpenLDAP and roll our own RPM due to our requirement for the PPOLICY module and our desire to be able to pick up different OpenLDAP versions for new features and bug fixes. Yesterday I tried building 2.4 due to your recommendation from another post, and got the following build error:

checking for Berkeley DB major version... 4 checking for Berkeley DB minor version... 3 checking for Berkeley DB link (-ldb-4.3)... yes checking for Berkeley DB version match... yes checking for Berkeley DB

thread support... yes checking Berkeley DB version for BDB/HDB backends... no configure: error: BDB/HDB: BerkeleyDB version incompatible

During my investigation I discovered the FAQ about BBD 4.3 being unstable. I took this information to my platform/base team and we discussed upgrading the library for all of our apps, as it's a commonly used shared library. They want to bring this info to RedHat and they asked me to dig into the statement that BDB 4.3 is unstable.

We tested BDB 4.3 heavily when it first appeared in 2005. In those tests we found that it tended to SEGV under heavy concurrent load. Building against BDB 4.2 showed none of these problems. You can probably check the openldap-devel archives from that timeframe for more details.

I also forwarded this information to the RedHat/FedoraDS team when I saw them integrating BDB 4.3 support in November 2006, but they ignored the info.

As usual, the RedHat folks are not only clueless, but aggressively so.

I do appreciate the help and didn't intend it to come across

otherwise.

Buchan knows what he's doing... If you don't want to follow his approach you might want to consider using commercially supported RPMs from people who are actually competent in supporting OpenLDAP (e.g., from Symas) to save yourself all of this hassle.